[luvxholic]

i'm a little confused about how LSAC recalculates your gpa...will you be able to find out what it is before you start applying? my friend told me the competitiveness of your undergrad instit matters in addition to the grades you got in CC + undergrad classes...

[V12Juice]

They don't really care about your undergrad institution unless you went to Harvard or Yale. LSAC takes in all the courses you ever took and combines it into their version of your GPA. This includes retakes (if you ever got an F and retook, the F will still be calculated into your LSAC GPA) and +/- (so straight A+'s = 4.33)

[bloated_stick_figure]

What are the chances of getting into a top law school if you've transferred undergrad schools 3 times, but your graduating gpa and lsat scores are really good? (like 3.7+ ~ 170ish+) Thanks!

::Edit::

ok - dumb me...for some reason I thought that the graduating gpa would be what mattered...
I know I've yet to take the real LSAT but if I have a 3.1~ish gpa but get above 175 on the LSATS - what are the realistic chances of getting into a top 14 school?

[V12Juice]

Let LSAC calculate your GPA and take the real LSAT first...

[g-yo]

So I've just graduated high school and I'm going to be heading to college in the fall.
I'm aiming for T14 law schools after undergraduate, concentrating on international law.

I understand that LSATs and GPA are the most crucial factors for law school admission, but I was wondering what other factors could possibly give me a boost to stand out from the crowd.
I know that soft factors come in only if some part of your GPA or LSAT is lacking, but realistically, wouldn't top candidates for law schools have high GPAs and LSATs? And wouldn't it be relatively difficult to differentiate these people if there were only GPA and LSAT scores?

I heard from another person that during an interview, there were really interesting individuals, like a wounded veteran, skydiving champion, PhD in English, etc.
I'm kind of know what kind of answers I'll get, but I'm just hoping I can get more insight on this.

[delightful123]

Hi everyone First time in this thread, but just wanted to say that I'm also aiming to take the LSAT this September. I'm going to start prep in a couple weeks with Testmasters... the site told me not to "prepare" beforehand so I can start fresh, so I haven't really started studying yet (minus taking a couple practice tests by myself at home). Eek! I hope this course is good.

I'm a rising senior at Northwestern with an English Lit major, Business Institutions minor. My GPA is not so good (3.6.. probably 3.59 when recalculated with LSAC because I have a number of B+'s) . Sad. I definitely need a high LSAT.

[V12Juice]

Where are you aiming for?

Testmasters is generally helpful, but honestly it all depends on the teacher.

[delightful123]

Haha. I'm aiming for T14 (NYU, Columbia, Michigan, NU, Chicago, Berkeley). I know, I know... with my GPA, it's a stretch. I'm just hoping for the best, and we'll see where I have a chance at after I take the LSAT.

I actually really want to go to NU, but I know that 1) going there for undergrad is apparently a disadvantage and 2) they HIGHLY recommend work experience, which I have none of (outside of summer work). I'm just hoping for an amazing LSAT ... so amazing that they'll either defer me or just take me anyway (work experience-less and all). Haha... I plan on taking a year off to study more and work if my LSAT isn't stellar though.. so we'll see.

[V12Juice]

Honestly, NU won't be a reach with a 3.6 IF you score well on the LSAT. How long have you been studying for the LSAT? Or how long do you plan to study for it?
Have you made an estimated guess on your LSAC GPA? B+ bring down your GPA more than you think. Assuming you get a 171 on the LSAT and assuming you have a 3.6, you will have a 76%~ at NU. 3.6 + 169 = less than 50%, so if you score less than 170 I would either retake or take a gamble at EDing.

[delightful123]

My LSAC GPA is a 3.59 (I calculated it). Is there a big difference between a 3.59 and a 3.6? And by what you're saying, I take it that you think even without work experience, I still have a shot at NU if I do well on the LSAT? I really hope so!

I plan on studying all this summer for the LSAT. I took a sample of a real LSAT by myself (timed and all), and I got a 161. I guess for taking it for the first time (cold), 161 isn't all that bad... but then again, it was at home, and I wasn't as nervous, and there's no telling if studying will improve it much, I guess. If I don't do well, I plan on taking a year off to work and study some more.

Thanks so much for your help, btw =]

[KIM_SAYS:]

If I send transcripts in by Oct., my fall quarter grades obviously won't be calculated. But if after fall quarter my GPA goes up (grades for fall will be up near the end of December), will I be able to send another transcript and will that GPA have any effect on admissions?

And random and unrelated: my prof. transferred to another uni. so I had to send her via snail mail the LOR form. I just realized I sent it without my signature. Pure idiocy. I'm sending her another form (signed) tomorrow. Hopefully this won't have an effect on my LOR.

[ronmexico]

My LSAC GPA is a 3.59 (I calculated it). Is there a big difference between a 3.59 and a 3.6? And by what you're saying, I take it that you think even without work experience, I still have a shot at NU if I do well on the LSAT? I really hope so!

I plan on studying all this summer for the LSAT. I took a sample of a real LSAT by myself (timed and all), and I got a 161. I guess for taking it for the first time (cold), 161 isn't all that bad... but then again, it was at home, and I wasn't as nervous, and there's no telling if studying will improve it much, I guess. If I don't do well, I plan on taking a year off to work and study some more.

Thanks so much for your help, btw =]

You'll have a shot, but NU really, really likes to see work experience. For whatever reason, they decided a few years ago to make their admissions process more like a business school's, so they interview applicants and want them to have work experience. The vast majority of their students worked at least a couple of years after college.

If I send transcripts in by Oct., my fall quarter grades obviously won't be calculated. But if after fall quarter my GPA goes up (grades for fall will be up near the end of December), will I be able to send another transcript and will that GPA have any effect on admissions?

And random and unrelated: my prof. transferred to another uni. so I had to send her via snail mail the LOR form. I just realized I sent it without my signature. Pure idiocy. I'm sending her another form (signed) tomorrow. Hopefully this won't have an effect on my LOR.

You'll be able to send the transcript, but you will likely have received some decisions by that point. That's assuming you send your applications in early, which you should certainly do. A single quarter probably won't have much of an impact on your GPA, so it probably won't affect your chances. But if you get waitlisted somewhere and your fall grades are good, it can't hurt.

[LUX.]

Which summer should I spend buckled down, preparing for the LSAT? Summer before my Junior year, right? I am a rising sophomore at the moment.
I'm planning on taking it twice; well, actually, I'd like to take it as many times as possible, but I assume any more than two would look strange, right?

Also, I know this is an awful question to ask, and a terrible mindset to have, but based off of my projections for my performance in the future, realistically would

- having a pretty good GPA
- coming from an Ivy League undergrad with a BA in English literature (maybe in Classics as well)
- taking ~2 years off to work in the Peace Corps (or doing something that would give me some life/work experience; either way, I am almost certain I'll be taking ~2 years off to do my own thing)
- a good amount of ECs that show a variety of interests (Ivy Council, Editor-in-Chief, Copy Editor, Pole Dancer...)

permit me to get only a "good" LSAT score while still aiming to get into a T14 (NYU, Berkeley, Georgetown, UCLA), not bad, not great?
I know I shouldn't be pessimistic, but I know myself pretty well and just don't think I'll get a great score no matter how much I prepare. Really, I'll probably plateau or something.

What do you recommend/advise I can and should do to compensate for only doing fine on the LSAT?

Thank you so much!

[delightful123]

^
Granted, I haven't actually applied to law school yet, so perhaps I'm not the BEST person to respond, but I've done a lot of research (poking around forums and sites, etc.), and I'd have to say.. just do well on the LSAT (haha).

1. Having a "pretty good GPA" is REALLY great (I'm so jealous!), but I don't think it compensates for a mediocre LSAT at all. From what I've read and seen, it seems that the LSAT is almost more important than the GPA (though maybe not for all schools). I've seen a lot of people with great LSAT scores and mediocre GPA's get into schools, but not as many the other way around.

2. One thing I've definitely noticed is that coming from an ivy league won't really help you. Apparently, the rank of your undergrad means nothing to law school admissions officials. I think I've heard somewhere that certain ivies like to accept people that went to ivies (I think maybe Harvard and Yale?), but other than that, coming from an ivy league school won't really help you at all.

3. I'm sure taking time off to work could only add to your application (especially for schools like Northwestern), but again, it won't compensate for a mediocre LSAT score. I think work experience could perhaps help out a mediocre GPA, but a good LSAT score is pretty essential to get into a T14 law school (with a few exceptions, I'm sure).

4. Again, EC's are great, but they won't compensate for a mediocre LSAT score. From what I've read, EC's and other things like that are really not NEARLY as important as your GPA and your LSAT score (unless you did something incredibly unique and phenomenal).

I'd say aim for 170 or over to really complement your good GPA =]. Why not, right? If you have a good GPA, don't waste it! Study hard for your LSAT, and you'll be getting into a great school : ). I think at the very least (again, from what I've read), you'd need a 165 to even have slim chance at T14 (even coupled with a good GPA).

Edit: P.S. the 165 was a number I kind of just estimated after reading/researching. So make it 165... give or take a couple points? Haha =]

[V12Juice]

You can't really compensate for a low LSAT score. The only other factor that is as important as the LSAT is your GPA, but that alone will not get you into law school. EC's. I say you avoid hitting the plateau by hitting the books, hard. Self study, ask a friend, go to the Testmasters tutoring sessions, etc. If you plan on getting a low LSAT score, you will probably end up with a low score. Stop thinking like that and prepare yourself, you should realize how important the LSAT is... No EC will ever be enough for a splitter (unless you won the nobel prize or wrote the next harry potter series).

[KIM_SAYS:]

Which summer should I spend buckled down, preparing for the LSAT? Summer before my Junior year, right? I am a rising sophomore at the moment.
I'm planning on taking it twice; well, actually, I'd like to take it as many times as possible, but I assume any more than two would look strange, right?

Also, I know this is an awful question to ask, and a terrible mindset to have, but based off of my projections for my performance in the future, realistically would

- having a pretty good GPA
- coming from an Ivy League undergrad with a BA in English literature (maybe in Classics as well)
- taking ~2 years off to work in the Peace Corps (or doing something that would give me some life/work experience; either way, I am almost certain I'll be taking ~2 years off to do my own thing)
- a good amount of ECs that show a variety of interests (Ivy Council, Editor-in-Chief, Copy Editor, Pole Dancer...)

permit me to get only a "good" LSAT score while still aiming to get into a T14 (NYU, Berkeley, Georgetown, UCLA), not bad, not great?
I know I shouldn't be pessimistic, but I know myself pretty well and just don't think I'll get a great score no matter how much I prepare. Really, I'll probably plateau or something.

What do you recommend/advise I can and should do to compensate for only doing fine on the LSAT?

Thank you so much!

Honestly once you start studying and do a lot of prep tests, you'll come to realize that getting a really good score is something very doable. Studying for the LSAT can be quite fun.

[KIM_SAYS:]

Question regarding personal statements:

Should you choose a topic that directly relates to why you want to be lawyer or a topic that shows that you would do well in the legal field? Do you need to explicitly say something along the lines of "This experience taught me the skills required to be a lawyer" or "This experience led me to pursue a legal career?"

Or do you just need to choose a unique topic that shows the adcomms who you are? I have several unique experiences in mind that I think would be good for a PS, and while they do say something about me and some of the skills I have that perhaps would be good for law school, I don't think they can be directly related to law school/why I want to be a lawyer.

[LUX.]

^
Granted, I haven't actually applied to law school yet, so perhaps I'm not the BEST person to respond, but I've done a lot of research (poking around forums and sites, etc.), and I'd have to say.. just do well on the LSAT (haha).

1. Having a "pretty good GPA" is REALLY great (I'm so jealous!), but I don't think it compensates for a mediocre LSAT at all. From what I've read and seen, it seems that the LSAT is almost more important than the GPA (though maybe not for all schools). I've seen a lot of people with great LSAT scores and mediocre GPA's get into schools, but not as many the other way around.

2. One thing I've definitely noticed is that coming from an ivy league won't really help you. Apparently, the rank of your undergrad means nothing to law school admissions officials. I think I've heard somewhere that certain ivies like to accept people that went to ivies (I think maybe Harvard and Yale?), but other than that, coming from an ivy league school won't really help you at all.

3. I'm sure taking time off to work could only add to your application (especially for schools like Northwestern), but again, it won't compensate for a mediocre LSAT score. I think work experience could perhaps help out a mediocre GPA, but a good LSAT score is pretty essential to get into a T14 law school (with a few exceptions, I'm sure).

4. Again, EC's are great, but they won't compensate for a mediocre LSAT score. From what I've read, EC's and other things like that are really not NEARLY as important as your GPA and your LSAT score (unless you did something incredibly unique and phenomenal).

I'd say aim for 170 or over to really complement your good GPA =]. Why not, right? If you have a good GPA, don't waste it! Study hard for your LSAT, and you'll be getting into a great school : ). I think at the very least (again, from what I've read), you'd need a 165 to even have slim chance at T14 (even coupled with a good GPA).

Edit: P.S. the 165 was a number I kind of just estimated after reading/researching. So make it 165... give or take a couple points? Haha =]

You can't really compensate for a low LSAT score. The only other factor that is as important as the LSAT is your GPA, but that alone will not get you into law school. EC's. I say you avoid hitting the plateau by hitting the books, hard. Self study, ask a friend, go to the Testmasters tutoring sessions, etc. If you plan on getting a low LSAT score, you will probably end up with a low score. Stop thinking like that and prepare yourself, you should realize how important the LSAT is... No EC will ever be enough for a splitter (unless you won the nobel prize or wrote the next harry potter series).

Honestly once you start studying and do a lot of prep tests, you'll come to realize that getting a really good score is something very doable. Studying for the LSAT can be quite fun.

Thanks a lot for the replies everyone!
Not what I wanted to hear, but definitely what I needed to hear :/

[ronmexico]

Which summer should I spend buckled down, preparing for the LSAT? Summer before my Junior year, right? I am a rising sophomore at the moment.
I'm planning on taking it twice; well, actually, I'd like to take it as many times as possible, but I assume any more than two would look strange, right?

There's no reason to study for the LSAT before your junior year. Especially in your case, since you're planning to take at least a couple years off. Some schools won't accept an LSAT that's more than three years old, so if you took the LSAT in your junior year and wound up taking more than two years off, you'd have to take it again. You should also really only plan to take it once.

[LUX.]

There's no reason to study for the LSAT before your junior year. Especially in your case, since you're planning to take at least a couple years off. Some schools won't accept an LSAT that's more than three years old, so if you took the LSAT in your junior year and wound up taking more than two years off, you'd have to take it again. You should also really only plan to take it once.

Oh wow, I had no idea about the 3 years thing. Thanks so much for the info., definitely needed to hear that.